Romance Reverend Interviews "Love Doctor"
Daphne Rose Kingma
Daphne Rose Kingma has spent more than
25 years as a psychotherapist counseling couples and
writing books with groundbreaking insights on how to
make sense of our relationship experiences. They include
Coming Apart: Why Relationships End and How To Get
Through The Ending of Yours, Finding True Love,
Weddings From The Heart and most recently,
The 9 Types of Lovers: Why We Love The People We Do
& How They Drive Us Crazy (all from Conari
Press). Her fans range from Mary Ann Williamson, who
wrote the introduction to The Future of Love and
Neale Donald Walsh, who raved about it in Conversations
With God III. Yet she has taken on her mission to
heal our hearts and relationships with much devotion and
little media fanfare.
Daphne offers a truly unique and useful look at how
spirit moves us into the house--and houses--of love in, The
Future of Love: The Power of the Soul in Intimate
Relationships (Main Street Press, January 1999). I
think this book means even more to us today, post
September 11, as we truly stand on the threshold of the
transformations she discusses. She brings good tidings
about the emergence of the conscious, loving and solid
partnership between people who are committed to
utilizing relationship as a vehicle to evolution. And
she validates our suspicions that something larger than
our human personalities is at work in our romances. Yet
she warns that, as the status quo shifts, intimate
relationships may be in for unprecedented intensity; and
we may be shocked and pleasantly surprised by the many
ways love will manifest in our lives.
"The real undertaking of relationships is to
have an experience of love and we canít force love to
have a particular form of relationship," she said
in our interview. "I think weíre going to be
surprised by the forms and the people we are being given
to love. And we may also be surprised by that the forms
are many, and extraordinary, and they all can be
a container for love."
"Itís all in the process of
transforming," she said. "Something larger
than us is breaking up the relationship pattern. Its not
as if we all woke up one day and said lets make mayhem
in our relationship lives. This transformation really is
to show us that, no matter how diverse the forms, love
is still operating. I think weíre being shown that,
through awareness, we can honor love -- wherever it
occurs. If we can expand through our prejudices and
limitations, more love can occur."
Reverend Laurie Sue: Relationship issues are a
national obsession. Itís tough to be in them, tough to
be without them. Why are so romantically challenged?
Daphne Rose Kingma: I think in a way it's because weíve
been sold a mess of pottage. We believe relationships
are supposed to be perfect, that partnership will always
be ideal, that marriage is the one thing in life that
canít corrode or corrupt. But the purpose of
relationship is to really grow our souls. Itís very
hard to keep that in mind because we are so romanticized
Itís confronting to think intimate relationships
may challenge us even more than they already do.
Weíre just so engaged with our emotional lives that
to find out that they too are going to go through the
chaos (of the times) is very disturbing. Looking at the
whole phenomenon of our relationship lives in a
spiritual context really is the only way that the
suffering experiences of relationships make sense. I
think weíre all trying to make this transition from
personality to spirituality. Thatís a very big step, a
huge step--and weíre not certain weíre ready to take
it. Itís very scary--in this culture,
especially--because weíve really elevated
relationships to the level of a God. So, to not have
them be absolute in our lives--absolute fulfillment,
absolute security, absolute comfort, absolute witnessing
of who we are, absolutely indestructible and forever--is
When people get a whiff of what relationship can be
from a highly spiritual perspective, itís sometimes
tough trying to ground it in the real world.
The human experience is an interesting tension
between the material and mundane world, and, on the next
level, the emotional. Itís a mixture of those levels
with the transcendent spiritual. We are uniquely called
to continue to move back and forth in this reality where
we get to experience it in terms of great awakenings,
soul connection and divine love, along with Saturday
night dates, co-parenting the kids, socks on the floor,
red roses, car accidents, hospitalizations. Weíre
being invited to experience love as it is infused in
this material plane.
That is so trueÖ and whether we are tuned in or
not, the soul is busy helping us to grow?
Consider that beautiful image of the Kundalini and
the two chords interwoven. I think people need to know
we are always simultaneously personality and
spirituality and the development of those aspects may be
parallel and synchronistic or it may be very uneven.
People who are "seeking" are more likely to
have the soul opening through their personality
experience and vice versa. People who are just watching
television are going to have a harder time in general.
Awakening is a combination of a divine gift --and itís
purely a gift--and ones own movement toward it.
Isnít it possible to have soul friends who are not
In general, there is a great movement toward soul
connection. In the American culture we tend to
romanticize it. Weíve elevated the relationship to the
level of soul mate, as in youíre going to
find your soul mate and live happily every after. I
think more and more soul connections are being made and
acknowledged and itís not just lovers or marriages. Itís
more like people crossing paths with kindred spirits and
recognizing theyíre undertaking something together.
But soulful, passionate romantic love is here to
Absolutely and I call that "Illumined
relationships." But I think what we need to realize
is sexuality is the divine attraction and romance is the
Spiritís way of inviting us into the relationship
which will then invite us to grow. American
consciousness is stuck at the romance step.
When the tinglies die down and reality bites, we get
nervous and think "this isnít working."
Exactly. We mistakenly think that it should be a
45-year romance as opposed to a 45-year journey of
spiritual evolution or of psychological evolution--and
hopefully both. The romantic myth is held in a container
with very specific attributes: It must be daily,
domestic, exclusive and forever. And we really believe
that these are the four tent pins that will hold up the
romantic myth. In fact, they donít. They hold up daily
life and a lot of times they donít hold up daily life
that well. Romance imagines the 100 per cent
connection. It really is like God: Youíre going to
make all my dreams come true, be the perfect partner,
protect me, be the great lover, the perfect parent. Itís
the expectation of perfection. That is what the high
energy of romance is. Its like youíre the one, forever
true, only you, it has that quality of ...
A devotional, yes. And because we havenít made the
distinction between that spiritual longing--the longing
for God, for absolute union--we are continually
disappointed in our relationships.
What does it take to make a relationship strong and
A conscious awareness that these relationships are a
spiritual as well as a psychological undertaking. And
that the tests and crises within them are always an
opportunity for spiritual expansion. Which means, put in
simple terms, a greater capacity for love, and a more
inclusive love. Itís like this: Can you love the
person whoís driving you crazy? Itís always a
question of can you expand your capacity for love?
Thatís the great test Ö but how many of us can
In this culture, we have not seen many examples of:
what does a relationship look like when itís really
about love? Weíve seen it when itís about
keeping up with the Jonesís, when itís about healing
the wounded child. We havenít seen it when itís
really an embodiment of love. We need to see what it is
to treat your partner as a king or queen, to lovingly
hold the person you love, to live your sexuality as an
experience of opening consciousness as well as physical
passion, to live in an environment that is peaceful. I
know a number of couples whoís spiritual work, I
believe, is just to hang around and show people what
love looks like; to embody what marriage looks like when
itís lived on the spiritual level. And that takes
consciousness of saying: We are undertaking this. And
we choose to go through those rites of emotional and
spiritual passage in a relationship that will bring us
to a larger place.
Do you believe all relationships are gifts?
I believe a relationship is a very profound spiritual
gift. Think of it this way: You cannot insist a
relationship into your life. You canít say, "This
is Friday. Iím going to go downtown and buy myself a
relationship." You can buy yourself a shirt, a car
or a bottle of orange juice but you canít do that with
a relationship, so it is a spiritual gift.
I have in recent years seen an extraordinary trend of
people finding love where they least expect it. When we
drop our expectation of love having to "look a
certain way," it really opens up the door to great
At the soul level we are open...to that person
who is a different color, speaks a different language,
or is deaf. This is about surrendering. We are brought
the experience of love that our soul needs. The nature
of the soul is itís so powerful that it draws us off
our ego, off the path where we think we are in charge,
and surprises us about the nature of love.
Are these relationships easier or more comfortable?
The truth is, very often, soul connection
relationships are the most demanding because they come
into our lives to require us to let go of something that
weíre really entrenched in or to transform us in a way
thatís very difficult. The soul is trying to
bring--and bring and bring--home the lessons.
How does the soul speaks to us and move us in
The soul uses the personality--aspects of the
personality, such as passion, need, childhood wounds,
and hormones--to take us to a lesson. Itís like you
walk by the bakery, and smell the fragrance of the fresh
bread. Thatís what draws you in. Thatís why some
relationships are such a surprise: oh, why am I with
this woman who doesnít speak my language? Why
am I getting married when I swore I never would? I
donít know if we actually know where our souls are
taking us, in the moment, unless we are very conscious.
We may have that ineffable feeling that says my soul
is telling me to be here, but a relationship is
always an interplay of the personality and the soul.
They are both always growing but itís hard to see what
the soul is teaching is until later.
People often wonder, "How will I know he/she is
the one?" What is your spiritual Litmus test for
knowing the soul has delivered us to the
Whenever we feel love, wherever we are changed by
love, the soul is at work. But in a given time frame, it
may not look right. You can say, "Well this is
the last guy on earth I thought I would of fallen in
love with, but I am feeling love here." Thatís
the soul at work.
On the other side of the spectrum, how does the soul
let us know with certainty when itís time to move on?
You know when the relationship is finished. It
may go through a process to get to that point but you
move toward it and thereís a poignant understanding of
"Oh, I guess weíre not supposed to set up
housekeeping together" or "I guess we
really have finished what we came here to do."
Sometimes there simply is no energy in a relationship.
Sometimes itís announced by another person showing up
and sort of holding a lantern: oh hereís the next
step Iím supposed to take. Many people find that
difficult because of the notion that we can only love
one person in a lifetime.
So should we follow our hearts to love, or should we
follow our souls?
I think when we follow our hearts weíre being led
by the soul. We can trust love. Love is always a journey
and people want it to be a destination. Its like, okay,
Iíve got that nailed down, now I can go and work n my
career. But the real experience of love is a
continually unfolding journey.
What do soulful singles need to know about coping
with the trauma and drama of relationships in tumultuous
The important thing we need to realize is we are in a
time of great change and upheaval in our relationships
and this is not a disaster. But itís an
opportunity...to expand our capacity to love and to
expand our experience of love. If we can relax into that
and trust, we can actually experience more love and the
more vast experience of love that our souls are leading
us toward. They are not leading us to specific
relationships; they are leading us toward ever-expanding
experiences of love. Much bigger than we ever imagined.
The ultimate goal of all our relationship experiences is
to deliver us to a place of pure love. No judgment, no
ax to grind, no needs to whimper over or insist on being
fulfilled. Just love. Pure love."
by Daphne Rose Kingma:
© Copyright 2001
Reverend Laurie Sue Brockway All Rights
What kinds of relationships will you include in your Future of Love?